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Windows 10 ?

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Tom
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Hi - is there going to be any specific TI 2015 / Windows 10 testing, or do we just suck it and see ?

-Tom

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Forum Hero
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#1

Until Windows 10 goes RTM there will be no guarantee that 2015 will work OK with it. The beta -> preview -> RC builds will alter quite a bit, so there is no way of knowing at this stage what may or may not need to be altered or enhancements that can be made for W 10 as yet.

It isn't even available officially for Technet and most MSDN subscribers as yet, let alone an official beta/RC for the general public.

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#2

I did a fresh install of Win 10 (from ISO) and afterwards booted Acronis Disk Director 12 (via USB) to see what it could see. It sees the Win 10 partitions, but it has them all greyed out as unsupported. Even the D: drive partition I added after the install for user docs is greyed out.

I separately booted into Acronis True Image 2014 (via USB) and it didn't seem to have any qualms backing up the partitions. But I haven't tried to do a recovery yet. I'm going to backup using windows built-in image backup first before I go any further.

The following is from what somebody else posted at www.maximumpc.com/try_out_microsofts_windows_10_technical_preview_today_2014 

1. NONE of the Acronis Backups for Windows 10 are compatible with Acronis Backups for Windows 8.1
Different Partition scheme
If you restore a Windows 10 backup like you do for Windows 8.1, it will not boot
-------------------------------------------------------
2. Windows 10 FORCES Acronis to Reboot in order to restore a backup REGARDLESS of whether or not the restored drive is the boot drive
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#3

I think DD would have been hard coded to only recognise those OS' that are available in the retail/OEM market.

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#4

So, after using windows native image backup, I was able to confirm that the image restore from that worked just fine. I did this from a usb "recovery disk".

And the same is true for Acronis True Image 2014. The image restore (full disk recovery) from that worked just fine too. I did this from a usb stick as well. That is, I didn't do the recovery from within Win 10; in fact I haven't even tried to install Acronis True Image 2014 into Win 10.

Again this is for a fresh install of Win 10.

Edit: I've noticed that there is a subtle difference. When I restore an image using Acronis, I get about 400MB of unallocated file space before the first partition. The same isn't true when I use windows native image backup/restore; there's no unallocated file space before the first partition. [Edit 2: Apparently this is a known "non issue?" even with Win 8.1.  I'm using an SSD too.]

There's another interesting difference too. When I did the initial install of Win 10, I was limited in how much I could shrink the C: drive due to "immovable system files". After I do a restore with Acronis, I can shrink my C: drive pretty much as I want. The same isn't true when I do a restore with windows native image backup/restore; I'm still limited by "immovable system files".

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#5

I've installed TI 2015 in Windows 10. Everything seems to work just as it does in Windows 8.1. I did a full disk backup from within Windows. I restored the full disk backup to the same disk using WinPE. It restored perfectly and kept the partition order and size exactly the same as it was created by the clean Windows 10 install. This is a major improvement over TI 2014. As you have seem, TI 2014 changes the partition order and position. Originally, your disk had a 1 MB offset (unallocated space) at the beginning of the drive followed by a 300 MB Recovery partition, a 100 MB EFI System partition, a 128 MB Microsoft Reserved partition and your Windows partition. After the restore by TI 2014, you have the 128 MB Microsoft Reserved partition in exactly the same place as it was originally. The space where the 300 MB and 100 MB partitions were is now unallocated space. After the 128 MB Microsoft partition TI 2014 placed the 300 MB Recovery partition followed by the 100 MB EFI System partition followed by the Windows partition.

If you want to put your disk back in the correct format, you can restore it with the Windows Backup you made. Now if you were to image it and restore it with TI 2015, you would see that the partition order would be correct.

Beginner
Posts: 3
Comments: 11

#6

Please be patient with my questions. I'm still a beginner with a computer in terms of technical issues.
This is regarding the upcoming Windows 10 vs. being able to still use True Image 2014. I do a custom/full system back up. I don't do anything with partitions. So far I have not thankfully needed to do any recoveries so I don't honestly know how well this product will work for me. I am currently on Windows version 8.1.
I got this computer shortly before the 8.1 upgrade and Acronis was quick to upgrade the then fairly new purchase of their product.
I'm not one to just purchase software every year as it comes out (for anything I absolutely do not need).
And it seems Acronis is up in the air also regarding what will handle the new version of windows. It seems that there was adequate advance notice of the operating system changes for all of the necessary steps to be in place for a company like Acronis.
I'm looking forward to upgrading to Windows 10 but reluctant to not have a system back up in full working order. Is there any reason why I can't just make a new set of bootable CD's and do a new full system upgrade afterwards and feel confident that it will be my life line if I need it?
If there is not a 100% guarantee that Acronis can even accommodate those with True Image 2015, what are all of you who are jumping into windows 10 planning to use for a safe, reliable system backup?
Thanks in Advance!

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#7

Note, a complete answer can't be given until after Windows 10 is officially available.

Microsoft and or Acronis may bar TI 2014 from working on W10. Having said that, as Microsoft are auto upgrading Windows 7,8 and 8.1 users to W10 and there is a likelihood that some of those users will be on older software I would think it would work. The main problem might be the ability to mount an image.

Using the Linux based recovery media to make and recover images will work no matter what Windows OS you use.

Beginner
Posts: 3
Comments: 11

#8

Thank you for your prompt reply. Do you mind if I ask you what version of Acronis you are using? And have you ever personally used the Linux based recovery media you are referring to. I've heard of Linux, in the broadest sense possible. Acronis was recommended by my brother who has been an avid user of their products for both his work and home needs. That said, he retired all this systems at home with XP and has a few now with Windows 7 running. I don't expect that he will hassle with an upgrade at this point, even if it is free. He's used windows 8.1 and hated the operating system.
Since I knew nothing about backing up a system for emergency recovery, my brother told me what to purchase and walked me through the settings, etc for the first full system back up with instructions on when/how to continue doing back ups. I am not set on a weekly or automatic back up. I do it when I add a lot of new programs, or make substantial changes to my system that I wouldn't want to risk losing again.
My biggest need for this lap top is for photo work and video editing. I back all of that up to 2 external hard drives after all the editing is finished and do so on a regular basis. I don't keep the external hard drive hooked up to the lap top- it just would not make life any easier.

I was hoping not to have to learn another new software package (and read some awful reviews of True Image 2015- no clue if they are correct though).
I do not take to learning anything new easily and even though I did pick up on windows 8.1 fairly easily over a few months time (yes, and I find myself still discovering that I can do something I didn't yet know I can- embarrassed to say after all this time), I am leery of learning Windows 10, but anxous too.
The thought of having to start from scratch with a new product for back up is scary- especially if I go to Linux that I don't know anyone who uses the product so no one personally that can help me set it up, answer my questions of the "how to", etc

So please tell me what you have, what you plan to do- etc. It will make me feel better to know what you are trusting to use for the windows 10 upgrade.
If you are a Linux user, can you tell me if their back up/recovery program is user friendly. If I ever needed to do a system recovery- would I be able to understand how- besides doing the original back up.

Would I be able to clear the external hard drive I bought and use as a dedicated one for the windows 8.1/true image 2014 or would I also need to buy a new external hard drive in addition to a new software package. Darn but these computers can sure be money pits.

The family also has a desktop and we are running Acronis 2014 on that- purchased again and it's own dedicated external hard drive so you can see the prices would get steep.

For now I know this is just advice and info and I appreciate it. I want you to understand I will still research your replies so this will not fall onto your words solely but used for me as a reference guide. This way I hope you will feel better talking freely with me (and for others in this same situation).

Do you think Acronis or Linux is the better way to go from here forward? And again, what are your plans for the windows 10 backup.
Many thanks for your quick reply.

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#9

Paperandpen;

I think I have confused you.

So that systems can be restored for example when a disk drive has died and a new one is installed a method is needed to access your backup image(s) so that you can restore your OS (or data drive/partitions) to the new disk. As the new drive won't have an operating system on it, the methods normally used by most disk imaging products is to use a Linux based recovery media or a Windows PE one.

Linux based ones (the default with Acronis software) are the most flexible. You don't need to learn any Linux commands apart from some rare circumstances if you have a problem booting your system from Linux. Only Linux booting files exist and they automatically launch True Image once they've loaded. The True Image GUI looks slightly different to the Windows based version, but used to be the same GUI as for Windows. Therefore it is easy to use and you will have no idea that you have booted from a Linux mini OS rather than from a Windows PE one.

I make both Linux and WindowsPE (WindowsPE is a mini version of Windows aimed at booting PC's in order to perform another task such as install Windows itself for example), recovery media and have them on USB sticks.

Now as it is the full version of True Image that is included on the recovery media (some Windows specific items are not there) you can use this version to make and recover images. What you can't do though in either the Linux or WindowsPE environment is set up imaging schedules.

For my main machine I don't use True Image but the corporate version, Acronis AB11.5. However I have True Image 2015 on my tablet running Windows 10:10240 Technical Preview. I have made both a Linux and WindowsPE recovery media to boot this tablet.

If you are running old PCs (that is ones that don't have a UEFI BIOS) then using the Linux based recovery media is fine. If your PCs are Dells or HPs then some models do require some tinkering of the Linux install.

If your PCs do use UEFI BIOSs, then if they are computer shop or home made Linux again is fine, if they are brand names, you will possibly have to use the Windows PE version.

Why don't you download the trial version of True Image, which allows you to make a Linux based recovery media (on CD or USB stick) and see how you go? Although making images is limited to the trial period, you can recover images past that period.

Beginner
Posts: 3
Comments: 11

#10

Hi Colin
Many thanks. I admit I am/was confused, but did some research after your last reply so I could be certain I understood the wealth of information you shared with me.

This is a Dell laptop(2013) which started with windows 8, so yes, both this and the Dell desktop (2014) use UEFI.
I am confused about one last issue. Originally when I got the Acronis software I was told by someone I should get a WD external hard drive to use
for only the system back ups/recovery.
I did that and only do a back up of the entire system every few months or if I add major programs, etc. I have separate external hard drives that I save all the other things like photo work on.

My question is how would I (if I understood correctly yet again) with windows 10 use a thumb drive to do a full system back up? I've looked into software and see that the True Image 2015 had a lot of complaints in the reviews. I assume I'd end up going with the Acronis unlimited (think that was the product name).
Is there any way that I can load that onto the same external hard drive I'm using now and keep the windows 8.1 back ups and the windows 10 back ups on the same hard drive? I'm not certain if that would totally confuse the external hard drive with the different programs loaded or not interfere at all?
I hope this makes sense. I struggle with learning new things on computers!
I honestly don't want to do any practice/test recoveries because I'm nervous I'll do something I can't undo! I'm hoping that everything is saved properly and that I never need to access it. When I open the recently saved data it "looks right"!

I truly appreciate all of your time and help. I want to use Windows 10 for a short time and be certain I am going to make the switch permanent. I'm probably one of the few people who have no problems with Windows 8.1.

Many thanks !